OCSD Changes Live Scan Process

I emailed the OC Board of Supervisors with concern over the current issuance procedure. This is the entire mail chain.

Initial email to all 5 BoS members:

Hello, I’m writing you this email as an Orange County resident and a concerned citizen. I’m very happy with the decision that the Orange County Sheriff has made to increase the working hours and number of personnel that are spent processing CCW applications. I believe it was the Board of Supervisors who had made the suggestion to the Sheriff. While the amount of applications being processed has increased exponentially, there is now a new “choke point” in the process.

As I’m sure you’re aware, California employs the use of Live Scan stations which are run by California Department of Justice certified person(s). These stations and their operators are trusted to fingerprint for numerous types of checks, including working with children. However, the Sheriff’s department is not allowing applicants to use these Live Scan locations as they’re requiring all applicants who have initial approval (which includes the departments own background check, a residency check, and an in person interview where one hands in their birth certificate and gives a thumb print) to only be scanned by the Sheriff department’s own Live Scan.

I have no doubt that this is to control the process to guarantee accurate results. I do wonder though, why a person who has already been thoroughly investigated (CCW Applicant) is not trusted to have their Live Scan done at any one of the number of locations that the California Department of Justice has certified. The Sheriff departments restrictive hours (Only between 8am to 12pm, and 2pm to 4pm Monday-Friday) make it near impossible for anyone with a normal job to have their Live Scan done without putting in time off at work.

My final concern is with the trainers the department has listed. State law allows the Sheriff’s department to control which trainers they approve to teach the CCW class. Currently there are three companies listed with the OCSD as approved trainers. These are the same trainers from before Peruta was decided, which has brought a more “Shall Issue” process to Orange County. Currently the wait time for these trainers is months away, making this another “choke point” for the CCW process. It also allows these three companies to charge higher than normal rates for their services as they have guaranteed customers with little competition.

As a certified firearms instructor, I have inquired into becoming an instructor. The response from the Sheriffs Department was that they are not currently accepting applications for trainers. This is the same response that I received more than two months ago when I had initially inquired about becoming a trainer.

I urge you to please make suggestions to the Sheriff so she can amend the process so it is more comfortable and expedient for the residents of Orange County. It’s already been shown that OC residents want CCW, and now that it’s becoming a reality for so many law abiding people this will likely turn into a voters issue on the next ballot.

Greg Ryman
Orange County, CA.

First response from one of the member’s office:

Mr. Ryman,

Thank you for your email. Supervisor Bates has asked me to share your email with the Sheriff and the Sheriff’s Department.

Supervisor Bates is very pro-2nd Amendment and will do as much as she can to protect your rights and speed this process up. Please know that the Sheriff has sole discretion on the how the CCW process is administered. However, it never hurts to have our office express our concerns.

Thanks for writing,

Erik K. Weigand
Policy Advisor
Supervisor Patricia Bates, 5th District

Final email from the BoS Bates with a message from the OCSD:

Mr. Ryman,

I just received a response from the Sheriff’s Department regarding your email that I forwarded to them. Below is that response:

In the last few days some Board offices have received emails from constituent expressing concern about a backlog in Live Scan (fingerprinting) appointments for CCW applicants. The constituents attributed this back log to the fact that they believed the Sheriff’s Department required an applicant to have Live Scan performed only at the location on Flower Street in Santa Ana (on the first floor of the Brad Gates Building).

Today our staff did check in to this issue and found that we do (did), in practice, refer the applicants to our department’s Live Scan unit for processing. This has traditionally been done to avoid any DOJ report routing issues and DOJ fee collection issues. This was simply a practice and no official department policy exists mandating the use of our Live Scan Unit to facilitate this portion of the CCW process. Staff has contacted DOJ to clarify these issues in order to start allowing applicants to schedule and conduct the Live Scan portion of the process at any one of the DOJ approved Live Scan locations listed on their website (roughly 105 locations in Orange County alone). Applicants will still be afforded the option of utilizing our Live Scan facilities, but will now be able to use alternate locations if they choose to do so.

As of today, when an applicant is sent their “Approval Packet,” it will include the appropriate DOJ Live Scan form and associated instructions referring them to the Live Scan step at any facility listed on the DOJ website. This should help alleviate the “bottleneck” effect at the Live Scan step and provide the applicant a great deal of latitude in choosing a time and place that works best for their schedule.

Please continue to share the feedback you receive about the CCW process. As you can see, such suggestions are acted upon when possible. Let me know if you have any questions.

Thanks again for writing. It appears your email helped a significant amount of people.


Office of Supervisor Pat Bates

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Greg Ryman is a certified NRA instructor and RSO. He is also a California DOJ Certified Handgun Safety Instructor and a Certified Glock Armorer. Greg has been shooting for over 20 years and is the owner of Ryman Tactical.

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